I read parts of this to someone who is "Christian" and therefore has said (I quote) "The Jews did kill Jesus", but since he believes all Muslims are terrorists he supports the IDF action in Gaza and says that not to do so is anti-semitic(!!!!!?????!!!!)... I think I short circuited his brain.
Thank you for bolstering my fervent belief that there are people our there other than myself who can talk about things cultural without turning the discussion into a confused, splenetic torrent of hatred. Have a pleasant and relaxing dark time of the year!
A car in front of me the other day had a sticker on the back - it was a drawing of a Bible, and it read, "I'm not part of your fucking book club." I'm not a big car sticker guy, but if I had to have one, that'd be it.
different topic and bumper sticker but here in the South at a drive-thru pick up in front had stick figures mimic-ing the family ones you might see on SUV'S of family members holding hands in a row but these were figures of handguns and rifles with caption
"Welcome to my VERY LOUD family" i chuckled in the way you might walking thru a graveyard
Thank you. It is sad. Christianity is one of the most misrepresented, abused, misunderstood and perverted of religions. It's own adherents cannot even agree about its tenets as neither can the gospels. It would be useful if those who really care, (or 'believe' if you wish to use their parlance), could separate themselves from the scripture / dogma / ritual of the religion and simply focus on the plausible and useful positive qualities of the man.
Too much to comment on. For truth- Jesus is JEWISH- an Israelite. His God, who He likened to- Father, is the God of Christ & Christians.
Curtis & Billy are both dickheads.
It’s hard to say a lot else, because although Jesus’ life was short, He made a big impression. Just not on the freaking Pharisees, who like the priests et al since, are more caught up in dogma than the spirit of the Lord. “Big Mistake.” ;)
Lisa, we only have your side of the story about the Pharisees. How do we know if maybe they were super spiritual, following the Torah & subsequent writings to the letter?
I like that you question. There was so much going on really. However, the “Catholic” universal church under the God that chose to help the Jewish people, evolved in the same way. So besides what is written we have the experience of how the priests, & upper echelon eventually was based on the same Jewish Pharisees & Old Testament traditions, Jesus often railed against. And we’re handed down (Frankenstein-lol) over that millennium. A new millennium is upon us though. And truly, I believe that Jesus - who cured thousands, brought back people from death, didn’t have to die. So “Y”? If we don’t know “the ‘why’ behind something, or worse yet, there is no ‘why’,…” does it have value? If no value, why did those who followed Jesus “jump in with both feet,” so to speak. I’m sure there were Pharisees who were holy, searching, trying. Look at Nicodemus. The problem (again) as you note “following writings to the letter,” are laws, dogma. Jesus tried to tell them -men’s laws are not more important than God's people.
[And other related material BS! We are spiritual beings.]. Hope this helps. Hard to discuss in any circumstances, but thank you so much for weighing in & so kindly. Have a nice weekend. ☮️
As you no doubt know, evangelicals love you guys. L-O-V-E. My father, who has been a born again Christian for fifty years, wears a Star of David around his neck because he is so damn proud that he discovered a maternal, matrilineal, great great grandmother who was a German Jewish woman who emigrated to New Orleans in the 1840s. It’s so cringe and so adorable; I love him.
I’m also a Christian and have never understood the “Jews killed Jesus” thing. I mean, yeah, but if you believe enough in Jesus to care, then you also believe that it was God’s plan from before time and you trust he had his reasons for working through the Jewish people to accomplish his ends. That’s why it’s called Good Friday, because Jesus’ death was both good and necessary regardless of who did the work. Besides, in our Maundy Thursday liturgy - the night before Good Friday, in which we consider his death - part of the worship is the priest saying “Who killed this man?” and the congregation responding “We did; we did.” Point being, we all are responsible for our sins that required his substitutionary atonement. No point in getting nettled at the specific persons who carried it out.
"Jesus' death was good and necessary" Exactly! Judas was the most important disciple, if you think about it. His betrayal was a key stepping stone for the redemption of human kind.
There is a VERY unorthodox film "the last temptation of Christ" that gives Judas the depth he deserves, as a human being. Harvey Keitel plays Judas and he knows his role as the betrayer. And Christ demands of him that role. A simple dialogue in the film:
Jesus : I'm struggling.
Judas : No. No. I struggle, you collaborate.
Anyway, I was raised a catholic in Spain and my progressive nuns hammered in me the Jewish roots of Christ (and hence our Jewish roots). Not to say that monotheism has a lot of problems. When you have one God, human beings have a tendency to want to own It. And then the trouble begins.
Well I liked post. However, I don’t think the evangelists would like me. I’m pretty sure I have a 1st cuz that’s one (How does I one It are you a knower? 😂 What gave you THAT idea anyway?!). I said to him - so you think the Hindus are going to hell because they don’t believe only Jesus can get you to heaven? Well, sorry-
Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare; Hare Rama Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare... works for me too. Buddha? Meditation - 👍 works for mindfulness; transcendence & then there’s the 3 gates: Is it true? Is it kind; Is it necessary? ... Please don’t suppose to know who would love me. Unless you know me, Mr. Surly Reeks. [Oh. Damn AI! I meant Airily Reeks, but maybe they know better. Ya think? No? Me either. GIGO.]
I was going to comment 'nailed it' but stopped myself. I will now be the sole beneficiary of my excellent joke. But really, you did nail it. Again. As Always. Happy Yid-mas.
Perhaps meant to be humorous or satirical or perhaps an evocation of real feeling on your part. I can't know.
However, although there is certainly more attention being given to 'antisemitism', I doubt that it has increased as much as the mainstream media tend to assert. I also question how much of what is labelled as antisemitism is actually that at all. In many cases, it appears to me that it is simply a convenient target for those who lack the maturity to control their frustration, anger, poor self worth, peer group pressure or cultural conditioning.
The Jews, of course, are not the 'chosen people' and there is no evidence whatsoever for the existence past or present of any supreme entity, let alone one with a human son who was the result of immaculate conception and capable of miracles and rising from the dead.
Religions are the perpetual pandemic of humanity. Far from encouraging 'love' and 'togetherness', friendship, acceptance and understanding, religions create division. They even create division internally, let alone through their differences. Religions have, without any doubt, created more harm, persecution, horror, absurd laws and abhorrent punishments than any other institution that humanity has ever created.
The current genocidal acts of Netanyahu and his cohort are a not untypical example of religion at work.
The sooner that humanity matures and rids itself of the 'god' myth and the charlatans who profit from their positions as members of the hierarchies that churches have built to further their own ends, the sooner that humanity will have a chance to finally live in peace. Sadly, it is probable that such is too late and I doubt very much that we will see another century, let alone another millennium.
No intelligent and critical thinking person can possibly support the audacious and ridiculous myths invented and perpetuated by religions and those who established them. It makes a mockery of human intellect and all that we've learned and are discovering about ourselves, our planet and what is beyond it.
Fairies at the bottom of the garden - no thank you!
There are very few large blocks of text I agree with, but this is one of them. More on your first paragraph in a few weeks, but thanks for your comment.
I read the whole block (even though I also am anti block) and I really look forward to your reply because wow my existential crisis disagrees vehemently.
You're correct, Anot - stories, true or not, are powerful things. Jonathan Gottschall writes about this in "The Story Paradox," which I highly recommend. But it feels like this particular baby keeps fouling up the perfectly innocent bathwater, so I'm starting to wonder if there's not something wrong with this fucking kid.
The derogatory expletive is unnecessary. Your wondering is useful, despite its unfortunate focus on blame to the child rather than questioning of the whole issue, which is when it would have been very much what was needed.
'Kids' are the immature offspring of goats. It is sad that we use the term for children.
I will have to investigate mugwort. I occasionally take a .25 mgm of melatonin, 1/4th child's dose before sleep, crazy dreams. You might know that from some of my lyric posts.
I'm a goy married to a Jew. He will never admit it, but I believe he married me solely for a Christmas tree until death we do part. Only he didn't realize that this goy has a problematic relationship to the holiday. Early on in our marriage, I was dealing with traumatic family-of-origin issues and my four siblings and I had no interest in Christmas. He insisted we celebrate. He bought a tree, he made a lovely dinner, a good time was had by all and he became known as "The Jew Who Saved Christmas." He has managed to pull us through every year so that our children have had nothing but wonderful memories. Until this year. I tested positive for Covid on the 20th. He took one look at the test and a long woeful look at me: "You've finally managed to ruin Christmas!"
You are a gift, Shalom. Thank you for sharing your light with us.
My wife is an Italian-American and was raised Roman Catholic. Long ago, I pointed out to her that, since crucifixion was a Roman form of punishment and not a Jewish one, it was her people who killed Jesus. She agreed.
I'm 100 percent Jewish ✡. I absolutely agree that most Christmas songs suck. I'll admit that I like shiny and blinking things. Xmas has that up the wazoo. Some good foods too. I need to go now, a Joys bar is calling my name.
Romans 11:1 is written by the disciple Paul, who says that he is from the tribe of Benjamin, the youngest son of Jacob (renamed Israel). Jesus is from the house of David, because both of his parents are descended from King David, meaning that Jesus is essentially considered King of the Jews.
Jews killed scapegoats on the altar to appease God. Jesus was the New Covenant. The sacrificial Lamb of God, who paid the price of death for everyone's sins, obviates the need for God to kill sinners. But Jesus won't allow unrepentant sinners to have eternal life.
King David was from the tribe of Judah, one of twelve sons of Jacob, so Jesus was also descended from the tribe of Judah. Jesus frequented the area of Palestine, which had a diverse population.
I read parts of this to someone who is "Christian" and therefore has said (I quote) "The Jews did kill Jesus", but since he believes all Muslims are terrorists he supports the IDF action in Gaza and says that not to do so is anti-semitic(!!!!!?????!!!!)... I think I short circuited his brain.
Thank you for bolstering my fervent belief that there are people our there other than myself who can talk about things cultural without turning the discussion into a confused, splenetic torrent of hatred. Have a pleasant and relaxing dark time of the year!
A car in front of me the other day had a sticker on the back - it was a drawing of a Bible, and it read, "I'm not part of your fucking book club." I'm not a big car sticker guy, but if I had to have one, that'd be it.
I'm handing out a gold ✨ 🌟 for using the word splenetic. The spleen gets about as much respect as the usual. Loved the cat on the teddybear blanket.
different topic and bumper sticker but here in the South at a drive-thru pick up in front had stick figures mimic-ing the family ones you might see on SUV'S of family members holding hands in a row but these were figures of handguns and rifles with caption
"Welcome to my VERY LOUD family" i chuckled in the way you might walking thru a graveyard
The fuses in those brains were blown long ago.
I have had mine replaced.
On a regular schedule.
Thank you. It is sad. Christianity is one of the most misrepresented, abused, misunderstood and perverted of religions. It's own adherents cannot even agree about its tenets as neither can the gospels. It would be useful if those who really care, (or 'believe' if you wish to use their parlance), could separate themselves from the scripture / dogma / ritual of the religion and simply focus on the plausible and useful positive qualities of the man.
Take care. Stay safe. ☮️
Too much to comment on. For truth- Jesus is JEWISH- an Israelite. His God, who He likened to- Father, is the God of Christ & Christians.
Curtis & Billy are both dickheads.
It’s hard to say a lot else, because although Jesus’ life was short, He made a big impression. Just not on the freaking Pharisees, who like the priests et al since, are more caught up in dogma than the spirit of the Lord. “Big Mistake.” ;)
Root/scmoot... 😂
Lisa, we only have your side of the story about the Pharisees. How do we know if maybe they were super spiritual, following the Torah & subsequent writings to the letter?
I like that you question. There was so much going on really. However, the “Catholic” universal church under the God that chose to help the Jewish people, evolved in the same way. So besides what is written we have the experience of how the priests, & upper echelon eventually was based on the same Jewish Pharisees & Old Testament traditions, Jesus often railed against. And we’re handed down (Frankenstein-lol) over that millennium. A new millennium is upon us though. And truly, I believe that Jesus - who cured thousands, brought back people from death, didn’t have to die. So “Y”? If we don’t know “the ‘why’ behind something, or worse yet, there is no ‘why’,…” does it have value? If no value, why did those who followed Jesus “jump in with both feet,” so to speak. I’m sure there were Pharisees who were holy, searching, trying. Look at Nicodemus. The problem (again) as you note “following writings to the letter,” are laws, dogma. Jesus tried to tell them -men’s laws are not more important than God's people.
[And other related material BS! We are spiritual beings.]. Hope this helps. Hard to discuss in any circumstances, but thank you so much for weighing in & so kindly. Have a nice weekend. ☮️
As you no doubt know, evangelicals love you guys. L-O-V-E. My father, who has been a born again Christian for fifty years, wears a Star of David around his neck because he is so damn proud that he discovered a maternal, matrilineal, great great grandmother who was a German Jewish woman who emigrated to New Orleans in the 1840s. It’s so cringe and so adorable; I love him.
I’m also a Christian and have never understood the “Jews killed Jesus” thing. I mean, yeah, but if you believe enough in Jesus to care, then you also believe that it was God’s plan from before time and you trust he had his reasons for working through the Jewish people to accomplish his ends. That’s why it’s called Good Friday, because Jesus’ death was both good and necessary regardless of who did the work. Besides, in our Maundy Thursday liturgy - the night before Good Friday, in which we consider his death - part of the worship is the priest saying “Who killed this man?” and the congregation responding “We did; we did.” Point being, we all are responsible for our sins that required his substitutionary atonement. No point in getting nettled at the specific persons who carried it out.
"Jesus' death was good and necessary" Exactly! Judas was the most important disciple, if you think about it. His betrayal was a key stepping stone for the redemption of human kind.
There is a VERY unorthodox film "the last temptation of Christ" that gives Judas the depth he deserves, as a human being. Harvey Keitel plays Judas and he knows his role as the betrayer. And Christ demands of him that role. A simple dialogue in the film:
Jesus : I'm struggling.
Judas : No. No. I struggle, you collaborate.
Anyway, I was raised a catholic in Spain and my progressive nuns hammered in me the Jewish roots of Christ (and hence our Jewish roots). Not to say that monotheism has a lot of problems. When you have one God, human beings have a tendency to want to own It. And then the trouble begins.
Well I liked post. However, I don’t think the evangelists would like me. I’m pretty sure I have a 1st cuz that’s one (How does I one It are you a knower? 😂 What gave you THAT idea anyway?!). I said to him - so you think the Hindus are going to hell because they don’t believe only Jesus can get you to heaven? Well, sorry-
Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare; Hare Rama Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare... works for me too. Buddha? Meditation - 👍 works for mindfulness; transcendence & then there’s the 3 gates: Is it true? Is it kind; Is it necessary? ... Please don’t suppose to know who would love me. Unless you know me, Mr. Surly Reeks. [Oh. Damn AI! I meant Airily Reeks, but maybe they know better. Ya think? No? Me either. GIGO.]
I was going to comment 'nailed it' but stopped myself. I will now be the sole beneficiary of my excellent joke. But really, you did nail it. Again. As Always. Happy Yid-mas.
Baby Jesus knows what you almost wrote. Tsk.
This is great fun, thanks for the levity!
Here in the Hawkes Bay, New Zealand, it is a balmy 31 degrees centigrade,
Southern hemisphere Xmas has never been anything like Northern hemisphere myths and legends we New Zealand children grew up with.
I'm house/cat sitting. Loving a chance to read, write, be in a town I know hardly anyone.
Absolute unhurried peace and no over indulging in anything.
Feels wonderfully indulgent!
Have a beautiful solstice friends :}
What a beautifully written well balanced thought provoking piece, and the comments are glorious. Amen.
“Hell, that reindeer is probably a Jew, too.”
Live and learn, Shalom. I never realized that the animal ‘kingdom’ probably refers to THAT Kingdom. Great insights from you. Yet again.
😂
Perhaps meant to be humorous or satirical or perhaps an evocation of real feeling on your part. I can't know.
However, although there is certainly more attention being given to 'antisemitism', I doubt that it has increased as much as the mainstream media tend to assert. I also question how much of what is labelled as antisemitism is actually that at all. In many cases, it appears to me that it is simply a convenient target for those who lack the maturity to control their frustration, anger, poor self worth, peer group pressure or cultural conditioning.
The Jews, of course, are not the 'chosen people' and there is no evidence whatsoever for the existence past or present of any supreme entity, let alone one with a human son who was the result of immaculate conception and capable of miracles and rising from the dead.
Religions are the perpetual pandemic of humanity. Far from encouraging 'love' and 'togetherness', friendship, acceptance and understanding, religions create division. They even create division internally, let alone through their differences. Religions have, without any doubt, created more harm, persecution, horror, absurd laws and abhorrent punishments than any other institution that humanity has ever created.
The current genocidal acts of Netanyahu and his cohort are a not untypical example of religion at work.
The sooner that humanity matures and rids itself of the 'god' myth and the charlatans who profit from their positions as members of the hierarchies that churches have built to further their own ends, the sooner that humanity will have a chance to finally live in peace. Sadly, it is probable that such is too late and I doubt very much that we will see another century, let alone another millennium.
No intelligent and critical thinking person can possibly support the audacious and ridiculous myths invented and perpetuated by religions and those who established them. It makes a mockery of human intellect and all that we've learned and are discovering about ourselves, our planet and what is beyond it.
Fairies at the bottom of the garden - no thank you!
There are very few large blocks of text I agree with, but this is one of them. More on your first paragraph in a few weeks, but thanks for your comment.
I read the whole block (even though I also am anti block) and I really look forward to your reply because wow my existential crisis disagrees vehemently.
Taoism, Zen, and most if not all Native American spirituality lack most of these conflicts, I believe.
I also.
" No intelligent and critical thinking person"
Would 25% percent of humanity be a more or less generous percentage?
You might enjoy my post from yesterday as it addresses the issues you raise. And includes story about my twelve year old son that night amuse you.
https://robertsdavidn.substack.com/p/the-og-fascist-dostoyevskys-grand
You're correct, Anot - stories, true or not, are powerful things. Jonathan Gottschall writes about this in "The Story Paradox," which I highly recommend. But it feels like this particular baby keeps fouling up the perfectly innocent bathwater, so I'm starting to wonder if there's not something wrong with this fucking kid.
The derogatory expletive is unnecessary. Your wondering is useful, despite its unfortunate focus on blame to the child rather than questioning of the whole issue, which is when it would have been very much what was needed.
'Kids' are the immature offspring of goats. It is sad that we use the term for children.
🙏 Amen!
The bathwater is what we all bathe in, the heirarchy of authority.
Best wishes fighting demon tobacco. I did it in 1965 by only smoking hand rolling sage? or something, with tobacco. Finally just got tired of it.
Be well
I will have to investigate mugwort. I occasionally take a .25 mgm of melatonin, 1/4th child's dose before sleep, crazy dreams. You might know that from some of my lyric posts.
Thanks.
Just a small observation. I believe those quotes from Romans were written by Paul, apostle to us Gentiles.
Thanks, John - and Ariel below. I made that clearer in the post.
I'm a goy married to a Jew. He will never admit it, but I believe he married me solely for a Christmas tree until death we do part. Only he didn't realize that this goy has a problematic relationship to the holiday. Early on in our marriage, I was dealing with traumatic family-of-origin issues and my four siblings and I had no interest in Christmas. He insisted we celebrate. He bought a tree, he made a lovely dinner, a good time was had by all and he became known as "The Jew Who Saved Christmas." He has managed to pull us through every year so that our children have had nothing but wonderful memories. Until this year. I tested positive for Covid on the 20th. He took one look at the test and a long woeful look at me: "You've finally managed to ruin Christmas!"
You are a gift, Shalom. Thank you for sharing your light with us.
"The Jew Who Saved Christmas!"
Long story in short form.
Excellent!
Well I don’t know what music you like, but personally, I love this one: 🎶 “O come on come Emanuel; & ransom captive Israel.”🎵
... Back to the reading part <g>
All of this and also, nobody asks us for a damn thing for a whole bunch of days and, for all of that, this Jew will always love Christmas.
My wife is an Italian-American and was raised Roman Catholic. Long ago, I pointed out to her that, since crucifixion was a Roman form of punishment and not a Jewish one, it was her people who killed Jesus. She agreed.
So do Roman Catholics control Hollywood, or is that still Jews?
Did you not get that memo?
It is the godddamn leftist media stupid! Ummm?
😂
I'm 100 percent Jewish ✡. I absolutely agree that most Christmas songs suck. I'll admit that I like shiny and blinking things. Xmas has that up the wazoo. Some good foods too. I need to go now, a Joys bar is calling my name.
I don’t mind the music. It’s a birthday party, after all. And how’s this for cancelling myself out? I hate hate.
Romans 11:1 is written by the disciple Paul, who says that he is from the tribe of Benjamin, the youngest son of Jacob (renamed Israel). Jesus is from the house of David, because both of his parents are descended from King David, meaning that Jesus is essentially considered King of the Jews.
So I'm assuming he was against genocide then. In the right context, ofc.
Also, Paul, not Jesus, speaks in Romans 11:18, cautioning Gentiles not to feel spiritually superior.
Jews killed scapegoats on the altar to appease God. Jesus was the New Covenant. The sacrificial Lamb of God, who paid the price of death for everyone's sins, obviates the need for God to kill sinners. But Jesus won't allow unrepentant sinners to have eternal life.
That too will have to be revealed!
See online: "The Crucifixion of Jesus and the Jews," Professor Mark Allen Powell, Bible Odyssey (2023).
King David was from the tribe of Judah, one of twelve sons of Jacob, so Jesus was also descended from the tribe of Judah. Jesus frequented the area of Palestine, which had a diverse population.
Yes but spirituality and religion are not the same. ☮️
OMG - Can they have both tho? Or many even?
“I LOVE Berlin!”